add to wish list | library


50 of 53 recommend this,
would you recommend it?

yes | no

Support this site by purchasing from these vendors using the links provided below. As an Amazon Associate SA-CD.net earns from qualifying purchases.
 
amazon.ca
amazon.co.uk
amazon.com
amazon.de
 
amazon.fr
amazon.it
 
jpc

Discussion: Beethoven: Complete Sonatas & Variations - Wispelwey, Lazic

Posts: 16
Page: 1 2 next

Post by georgeflanagin July 23, 2006 (1 of 16)
I agree with the reviewers about the generally excellent recorded sound. I am particularly impressed with the weight of the left hand piano parts -- they seem quite natural.

However, there is a buzzing sound that is intermittently present, and now that I am aware of it, I find it annoying. It sounds very much like an inadequately grounded microphone. Listen for it during the quiet parts during the first movement of Op. 69, especially near the end of the movement. The fact that it will suddenly vanish from audibility leads me to believe that it is, in fact, a microphone problem.

Thoughts?

Post by Polly Nomial July 23, 2006 (2 of 16)
georgeflanagin said:

I agree with the reviewers about the generally excellent recorded sound. I am particularly impressed with the weight of the left hand piano parts -- they seem quite natural.

However, there is a buzzing sound that is intermittently present, and now that I am aware of it, I find it annoying. It sounds very much like an inadequately grounded microphone. Listen for it during the quiet parts during the first movement of Op. 69, especially near the end of the movement. The fact that it will suddenly vanish from audibility leads me to believe that it is, in fact, a microphone problem.

Thoughts?

Had a quick listen - will do more in-depth "study" tomorrow but I think it may just be a quirk of the cello used.

Post by seth July 23, 2006 (3 of 16)
georgeflanagin said:

I agree with the reviewers about the generally excellent recorded sound. I am particularly impressed with the weight of the left hand piano parts -- they seem quite natural.

However, there is a buzzing sound that is intermittently present, and now that I am aware of it, I find it annoying. It sounds very much like an inadequately grounded microphone. Listen for it during the quiet parts during the first movement of Op. 69, especially near the end of the movement. The fact that it will suddenly vanish from audibility leads me to believe that it is, in fact, a microphone problem.

Thoughts?

Please provide timings.

Post by synthy July 23, 2006 (4 of 16)
I most definitely hear it, and always have. It drives me crazy, but since no one else has ever mentioned it among the vast quantities of praise, I assumed I must have a defective disc or something.

It is present in the entire Sonata in F, in the first movement of the Sonata in G minor, in all of the Twelve Variations in G major, first three movements of the Sonata in A major (especially III, on and off in I), movements III and IV of Sonata in C, the whole Sonata in D, and the Theme of Seven Variations In E flat...

No timings are necessary, because it isn't really intermittent. It's the majority of the disc. It's definitely an electrical noise of some kind, a 50/60hz buzz kind of thing, and I think it probably is a ground issue. It fades in quite clearly in the very first track of disc one if you want a quick listen.

I listened to the multichannel layer and the CD layer.

Post by Jonty July 24, 2006 (5 of 16)
synthy said:

I most definitely hear it, and always have. It drives me crazy, but since no one else has ever mentioned it among the vast quantities of praise, I assumed I must have a defective disc or something.

It is present in the entire Sonata in F, in the first movement of the Sonata in G minor, in all of the Twelve Variations in G major, first three movements of the Sonata in A major (especially III, on and off in I), movements III and IV of Sonata in C, the whole Sonata in D, and the Theme of Seven Variations In E flat...

No timings are necessary, because it isn't really intermittent. It's the majority of the disc. It's definitely an electrical noise of some kind, a 50/60hz buzz kind of thing, and I think it probably is a ground issue. It fades in quite clearly in the very first track of disc one if you want a quick listen.

I listened to the multichannel layer and the CD layer.

Jesus, you guys. Just how loud are you listening. I have to turn the volume up way beyond normal concert levels to hear this clearly. It sounds to me more of a hum than a buzz and is quickly masked by the music. I don't find it at all distracting as it is so low. We have had much more venue noise (hums, rumbles, creaks, thumps, birds, traffic noise, bangs and crashes) from other records and companies. I think this is a fuss over very little.

Post by ramesh July 24, 2006 (6 of 16)
Jonty said:

Jesus, you guys. Just how loud are you listening. I have to turn the volume up way beyond normal concert levels to hear this clearly. It sounds to me more of a hum than a buzz and is quickly masked by the music. I don't find it at all distracting as it is so low. We have had much more venue noise (hums, rumbles, creaks, thumps, birds, traffic noise, bangs and crashes) from other records and companies. I think this is a fuss over very little.

Can you hear a snatch of orchestra in the background of Glenn Gould's 1981 Goldberg Variations, right channel, variation 15? And I only have the CD, not the SACD.

A golden ear is someone who can hear the Leaders Of The Free World conversing at thirty paces without the benefit of an active microphone. Yo Blair, how yer doin'?

Post by Jonty July 24, 2006 (7 of 16)
ramesh said:

Can you hear a snatch of orchestra in the background of Glenn Gould's 1981 Goldberg Variations, right channel, variation 15? And I only have the CD, not the SACD.

A golden ear is someone who can hear the Leaders Of The Free World conversing at thirty paces without the benefit of an active microphone. Yo Blair, how yer doin'?

Yes, it is there but I hear it centrally in both the original CD issue and the later CD version derived from analogue back up tapes at around 2mins 45 secs to 3mins 15 secs. Mind you, that is at deafening levels. The clicks and creaks in the studio are more distracting.

Post by synthy July 24, 2006 (8 of 16)
Jonty said:

Jesus, you guys. Just how loud are you listening. I have to turn the volume up way beyond normal concert levels to hear this clearly. It sounds to me more of a hum than a buzz and is quickly masked by the music. I don't find it at all distracting as it is so low. We have had much more venue noise (hums, rumbles, creaks, thumps, birds, traffic noise, bangs and crashes) from other records and companies. I think this is a fuss over very little.

You're very right about other venue noises, of course. Usually they don't bother me. It's just the persistence of this noise bothers me, that's all. I think my hearing is pretty normal, certainly not "golden ears," and the buzz is quite intrusive even on my computer system as background music, certainly not above-concert-level volumes.

Hum, buzz, to each his own. I chose buzz because it seems mostly high frequency, not a low "hum."

I love Channel Classics, I enjoy many of their discs. I'm not trying to create a fuss. I just see (hear) this as a problem. Less severe than the LSO Kullervo missing channel issue, more like the early Membran channel swap issue. Certainly more of an issue than the 2-second gap on the Membrans that got so many up in arms.

I guess if it doesn't bother anyone else, than it really is just me or my disc. I'll let it rest.

Post by Jonty July 25, 2006 (9 of 16)
Strangely enough, I find the disparities between sessions more disturbing. There is, in some movements, a possible reflection or piano mike pick up that causes some cello notes to have a buzzy sympathetic secondary sound and sniffs are more prominent. Perhaps this was what Polly Nomial hears. But it is not, I think, an electronic but more probably a mike position on particularly as the piano sound changes slightly as well.

Post by georgeflanagin July 27, 2006 (10 of 16)
seth said:

Please provide timings.

Wow, I get back to the office, and plenty of people have replied.

I first detect it at about 1:57 on track one of disc two, just as the music begins to get quiet. After that, it comes and goes. As someone else has pointed out it is the intermittent nature of the noise that is the annoyance.

Regarding how loud I or others may be listening, let me say that

[1] I am fortunate enough to have a very quiet room whose only purpose is to allow the two of us to listen to recordings. I live at the end of a 1 1/2 block long dead end street, and own the empty lot that would be my only neighbor. The listening room is downstairs in the corner of the house that is just a meter or so dug into the hillside. You can hear your heartbeat in the room if you sit still.

[2] I most definitely am not listening at live performance levels. Since my main speakers are the Quad 988, I know it can't be very loud. Glenda's grand piano is in another room in the house, and I have an idea how loud a live piano really is since I hear it daily.

It puzzles me that this sort of error happens fairly often. The train noises in that Angela Hewitt Couperin recording I reviewed are /loud/. They are also /low/, which is how I imagine they escaped attention, or were dismissed as insignificant. My subwoofer is crossed over at somewhere between 45 and 50Hz, and I have taken to listening to a great many recordings with the main speakers only just avoid the modern equivalent of turntable rumble.

The buzzing is a little harder to get away from.

Kind Regards,
george

Page: 1 2 next

Closed