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Discussion: Vivaldi: La Stravaganza - Podger/Arte Dei Suonatori

Posts: 21
Page: 1 2 3 next

Post by istvan December 28, 2005 (1 of 21)
Iím not a musician or academical critic but Iím a Vivaldi and Handel enthusiast. I love particularly the chamber recordings because they can reproduce the notes easily and the musicians can fit in my listening room behind the speakers. I was very exiting when I see on sa-cd.net this record on the first place of top recommendation among classical musicís. I ordered it for Christmas and put it the player quickly. I can play only the CD layer of the hybrid disc therefore my opinion relates to red-book song.

Unfortunately I was very disappointed. This looks like to me that it is a modern and spectacular record. My highest displeasure is that all pieces sound too laud with too narrow dynamic. I can hear laud piano level from the instruments and from the record mixer. I can see all instruments separately but it seems to me the microphones are too near to musicians. No one could listen to so on live concert not either from the first row. This performance is a truly concerto. All instruments would like to overtake the others and the listener couldnít know who is the concertmeister.

Sorry if my opinion oppose to majority. I hope and expect much more refinements from like record that has so many awards:
Gramophone: Best Baroque Recording of the year 2003/ Stereophile: recording of the month/ Cd des Monats: Alte Musik Aktuell/ Choc du Monde de la Musique/ Diapason díOr/ Th3e Absolute Sound October 2003 Classics Today 10/10/ Luister 10 Gramophone Editors Choice

It may be the SA-CD level better but I afraid the tendency might be alike. I have in my CD collection much more natural records e.g.: Fonè, Alia-Vox, Chesky.

Post by brenda December 28, 2005 (2 of 21)
istvan said: This looks like to me that it is a modern and spectacular record. My highest displeasure is that all pieces sound too laud with too narrow dynamic.
dear istvan, whilst i still like this disc, i do agree with you about the sound, which is much too close for (my) comfort. It's highly artificial, unless you spend your life living inside an orchestra on stage. Sadly, other Channel classics discs are much, much worse, - chamber music in particular suffering from miking that is way too close to capture genuine interplay between the musicians. So, whilst the the two sets of Bach choral music Channel have released have been much better miked, it's best to stay away from this label if you found the sound objectionable.

Post by Karlosak December 28, 2005 (3 of 21)
While I agree that this otherwise fine disc suffers a bit from close miking and poor dynamics, it would be simply false to say that other Channel Classics discs are much, much worse. This disc and few more are rather exception. Just listen to the fabulous recording Lux Aeterna by the vocal ensemble The Gents - exceptionally broad dynamic range (some climaxes are even too much on headphones) and great sense of space.

As to the popularity of this disc and many accolades it has received - the plain nature of the music goes really well with the recording technique used. Exciting and powerful interpretations combined with immediate and detailed recording promise an electrifying experience. Should the recording be more natural and laid back, the magic and drive might be simply broken.

Post by flyingdutchman December 28, 2005 (4 of 21)
istvan said:

Iím not a musician or academical critic but Iím a Vivaldi and Handel enthusiast. I love particularly the chamber recordings because they can reproduce the notes easily and the musicians can fit in my listening room behind the speakers. I was very exiting when I see on sa-cd.net this record on the first place of top recommendation among classical musicís. I ordered it for Christmas and put it the player quickly. I can play only the CD layer of the hybrid disc therefore my opinion relates to red-book song.

Unfortunately I was very disappointed. This looks like to me that it is a modern and spectacular record. My highest displeasure is that all pieces sound too laud with too narrow dynamic. I can hear laud piano level from the instruments and from the record mixer. I can see all instruments separately but it seems to me the microphones are too near to musicians. No one could listen to so on live concert not either from the first row. This performance is a truly concerto. All instruments would like to overtake the others and the listener couldnít know who is the concertmeister.

Sorry if my opinion oppose to majority. I hope and expect much more refinements from like record that has so many awards:
Gramophone: Best Baroque Recording of the year 2003/ Stereophile: recording of the month/ Cd des Monats: Alte Musik Aktuell/ Choc du Monde de la Musique/ Diapason díOr/ Th3e Absolute Sound October 2003 Classics Today 10/10/ Luister 10 Gramophone Editors Choice

It may be the SA-CD level better but I afraid the tendency might be alike. I have in my CD collection much more natural records e.g.: Fonè, Alia-Vox, Chesky.

You can't comment on the quality of a SACD based on the listening to the CD layer. It's a simple as that. To do so if not an acceptable review.

Post by istvan December 29, 2005 (5 of 21)
flyingdutchman said:

You can't comment on the quality of a SACD based on the listening to the CD layer. It's a simple as that. To do so if not an acceptable review.

You are right. I was able to write my opinion about only CD layer. I know this forum mainly serves to SA-CD music. Iím interested firstly in music secondly in reproducing technology. Yes, I will invest in a reasonable SA-CD player in next year (Iím thinking of Marantz SA-11S1 or Cary CD 306SACD, my wife donít know it yet). But Iím very conservative also. I have been reading war of high resolutions for years. Sony will come out PS3 in 2006 with CD and SA-CD compatibility in it. And what about is HD-DVD, more over much higher capability Maxellís 300GB holographic system? Or ďanalog buck to the futureĒ?

As I said Iím a conservative man. When I want to rating a High-End system after my well recorded CDís I like to put it an ancient mono piece: Blues on Verve 50th anniversary album (The Verve Story: 1944-1994) the first track on it that was recorded 1944 at Philharmonic Auditorium, Hollywood. The right system must to sound so I donít need to mind the record circumstances.

Buck to Vivaldi: La Stravaganza record. If you allow me Iíd like to know experiences others with this record on CD and SA-CD layer as I. The good records need to sound natural on CD layer and better on SA-CD layer well. Donít you?

I wouldnít put it to forum this issue if this Channel Classicsís CD didnít be the first scored position on top recommendation among the classical music.

Post by tream December 29, 2005 (6 of 21)
istvan said:

You are right. I was able to write my opinion about only CD layer. I know this forum mainly serves to SA-CD music. Iím interested firstly in music secondly in reproducing technology. Yes, I will invest in a reasonable SA-CD player in next year (Iím thinking of Marantz SA-11S1 or Carry CD 306SACD, my wife donít know it yet). But Iím very conservative also. I have been reading war of high resolutions for years. Sony will come out PS3 in 2006 with CD and SA-CD compatibility in it. And what about is HD-DVD, more over much higher capability Maxellís 300GB holographic system? Or ďanalog buck to the futureĒ?

As I said Iím a conservative man. When I want to rating a High-End system after my well recorded CDís I like to put it an ancient mono piece: Blues on Verve 50th anniversary album (The Verve Story: 1944-1994) the first track on it that was recorded 1944 at Philharmonic Auditorium, Hollywood. The right system must to sound so I donít need to mind the record circumstances.

Buck to Vivaldi: La Stravaganza record. If you allow me Iíd like to know experiences others with this record on CD and SA-CD layer as I. The good records need to sound natural on CD layer and better on SA-CD layer well. Donít you?

I wouldnít put it to forum this issue if this Channel Classicsís CD didnít be the first scored position on top recommendation among the classical music.

I think Istvan's point of view is interesting (as is his system!), but while I agree that the CD layer ought to sound good, one expects that a reviewer here will be commenting on the SACD layer, as this is a place for folks with SACD capability to congregate. So I concur that this review is a process foul, reluctantly.

Istvan, while you have been reading about high res wars you've been missing the benefits! Come on and jump in! I have somewhere between 400 and 500 SACD's now, and they spend a lot more relative time in my systems than my RBCD's.

I have not heard the Vivaldi in C, only the SACD layers (in stereo and MC). It is a closely miked recording, but IMHO is not objectionable, and I think the performances are worth hearing.

BTW, top recommendation means that more people have recommended this recording than any other, but that doesn't mean that it is the best or mostly highly rated SACD out there. While I recommended it, I am not sure this would be in my list of top 10 recommendations if I had only 10 to choose. The Channel Classics recording that probably would make that list is the Bach Christmas Oratorio, which is a wonderful performance, well recorded, with absolutely stunning packaging.

Post by istvan December 30, 2005 (7 of 21)
tream said:

................
I think Istvan's point of view is interesting (as is his system!), but while I agree that the CD layer ought to sound good, one expects that a reviewer here will be commenting on the SACD layer, as this is a place for folks with SACD capability to congregate. So I concur that this review is a process foul, reluctantly.
................

Dear Thomas

My entering into this forum didnít success too brilliant for me. I think it we can discuss music reproductions. We want to hear all the good performances seeking the best way. I beg your pardon I took two faults. Once was conscious namely I wrote my impression of this record only CD layer that I didnít suppress. Twice I offend the properties of forum. If I sought the forum more articulately about La Stravaganza record, I would not send my unpleasant review. There are so many info of Channel Classics's recording stylus.

I give you my admiration of your huge SACD collection. Probably I will never have had so many. I buy recently the music on hybrid disc, because I confide the future of this high-resolution format. I feel the SA-CD.net promotes it also.

István

Post by flyingdutchman December 30, 2005 (8 of 21)
istvan said:

Dear Thomas

My entering into this forum didnít success too brilliant for me. I think it we can discuss music reproductions. We want to hear all the good performances seeking the best way. I beg your pardon I took two faults. Once was conscious namely I wrote my impression of this record only CD layer that I didnít suppress. Twice I offend the properties of forum. If I sought the forum more articulately about La Stravaganza record, I would not send my unpleasant review. There are so many info of Channel Classics's recording stylus.

I give you my admiration of your huge SACD collection. Probably I will never have had so many. I buy recently the music on hybrid disc, because I confide the future of this high-resolution format. I feel the SA-CD.net promotes it also.

István

You didn't offend istvan. It's just that we've all come to the realization that there is a vast difference in redbook cd layer and the SACD layers. It's as if they're two different recordings.

Post by Windsurfer January 1, 2006 (9 of 21)
tream said:

I think Istvan's point of view is interesting (as is his system!), but while I agree that the CD layer ought to sound good, one expects that a reviewer here will be commenting on the SACD layer, as this is a place for folks with SACD capability to congregate. So I concur that this review is a process foul, reluctantly.

Istvan, while you have been reading about high res wars you've been missing the benefits! Come on and jump in! I have somewhere between 400 and 500 SACD's now, and they spend a lot more relative time in my systems than my RBCD's.

I have not heard the Vivaldi in C, only the SACD layers (in stereo and MC). It is a closely miked recording, but IMHO is not objectionable, and I think the performances are worth hearing.

BTW, top recommendation means that more people have recommended this recording than any other, but that doesn't mean that it is the best or mostly highly rated SACD out there. While I recommended it, I am not sure this would be in my list of top 10 recommendations if I had only 10 to choose. The Channel Classics recording that probably would make that list is the Bach Christmas Oratorio, which is a wonderful performance, well recorded, with absolutely stunning packaging.

What doe's Ms Podger's violin sound like? I associate "baroque violin" with something rather less rich than David Oistrach. I prefer the old Academy of St Martins in the Fields recordings to most of what I have heard played by "original instruments". Would I likely be disappointed in Ms Podger's sound on these discs - or the sound of the orchestra?

Post by seth January 1, 2006 (10 of 21)
Windsurfer said:

What doe's Ms Podger's violin sound like? I associate "baroque violin" with something rather less rich than David Oistrach. I prefer the old Academy of St Martins in the Fields recordings to most of what I have heard played by "original instruments". Would I likely be disappointed in Ms Podger's sound on these discs - or the sound of the orchestra?

The biggest change in sound will result from the baroque bow, not the violin and gut strings. The baroque bow is arc shaped, so the way you bow is completely different than the way Oistrach bowed (and even people in Mozart's time).

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