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Discussion: Steely Dan: Aja

Posts: 152
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Post by sordidman July 8, 2010 (81 of 152)
terence said:

extraordinary how utterly polarised opinions are on this disc already.

whither truth??!!

I respect what others have to say here, - to each his own.

I played the Redbook SHM CD of Aja, then I put on the SACD of Gaucho, then back to the SHM SACD of Aja, then on to Hugh Masekela HOPE SACD, - just for giggles. The Hugh Masekela and STeely Dan Gaucho SACDs were OUTSTANDING, and were hugely better than the AJA SHM SACD and the SHM redbook. Wowow that Gaucho SACD was amazing. (But hey, the original analog tape that it was made from could've been a lot better than Aja: I don't know).

Someone speculated that the polarity was reversed on the Aja SHM SACD transfer; that might make sense.

I can only relate what I heard, on my system. I had my downstairs neighbor with me, for all of the listening: he agreed 100%. We were using the SPL meter too.

Allegedly, both the SHM redbook and the SHM SACD were made from the same master.

There are folks who will be listening to SHM SACD with polarity reversed. I am anxious to hear their reports.

Post by Kikke July 8, 2010 (82 of 152)
I can't believe what I'm reading. I own the original 1977 vinyl album as well as the 30th anniversary edition by Cisco. I own the redbook CD and the MFSL remaster.
Now I'm spinning the SACD for the third time in a row as we speak. This is way, way better than the 30th anniversary version. Dynamic, well balanced without a trace of sharpens. Any voice can now be clearly understood. This is for as far as I'm concerned the definitive version. I don't see any room for further improvement.

Post by terence July 8, 2010 (83 of 152)
i repeat - whither truth?!

Post by danfaz July 8, 2010 (84 of 152)
terence said:

i repeat - whither truth?!

"There is no spoon."

Post by sordidman July 8, 2010 (85 of 152)
terence said:

i repeat - whither truth?!

It lies within

Post by terence July 8, 2010 (86 of 152)
my £50+ hangs on it. lot of money for something that according to some is a sonic turkey....

Post by danfaz July 8, 2010 (87 of 152)
terence said:

my £50+ hangs on it. lot of money for something that according to some is a sonic turkey....

Yeah, I understand what ya mean. I took the chance, and in all honesty, I am very pleased with this SACD. That's all I can say, really.

Post by Kikke July 8, 2010 (88 of 152)
terence said:

my £50+ hangs on it. lot of money for something that according to some is a sonic turkey....

Some should have their ears checked out or upgrade to better gear or both at the same time. Your £50+ will be well spend..

Post by sordidman July 8, 2010 (89 of 152)
Kikke said:

Some should have their ears checked out or upgrade to better gear or both at the same time. Your £50+ will be well spend..

That's a very easy and quite unfair dismissal.

Do you not think that it's insulting to say that "some people should have their ears checked?" Any reasonable person's first reaction would, and should be, to tell you to piss off. But, again, your opinion is no more valid than anyone elses.

Since, some of those people may have some of the most highly regarding SOTA SACD players going. But, the other point, is comparisons, and listening tests done with comparable SACDs.

These kinds of tests of "sounds better" are absolutely subjective anyway. So, - as stated: what other discs are being compared. And, are people flipping the polarity.

Have you compared yours to the Steely Dan Gaucho SACD, the SHM redbook version of Aja?
What is your SACD player? You also said that it is "smoother," - well, - that's a big minus, - and might just mean that you have a low quality player.

Here's my more detailed impressions as posted elsewhere.


""Initial back and forth... impressions from me and my downstairs neighbor who is also a HUGE Steely Dan fan.....

We played Peg, Josie, Black Cow, and Aja over and over comparing the SHM redbook with the SHM SACD. (We used a SPL meter to dial in the volume)

1. SACD is higher resolution: instruments are slightly more "real" sounding. The bass notes on the piano and the guitars have more realistic "weight" and texture. (That's about as good as it gets).
2. Dynamics are noticeably worse on the SACD: SHM redbook has more volume disparity between instruments.
3. Instruments are separated better on the redbook SHM: much bigger soundstage. Instruments seem to be heard better in the front and back of the soundstage. But the big deal is that the SACD mix sounds like everything is compressed into the middle, between the speakers.
4. The SHM redbook CD sounds more relaxed and we both swore that the pacing is better on the redbook SHM.
5. The redbook SHM just had a better, more aggressive initial note attack and aggressiveness where the instruments were aggressive. We both loved Steve Gadd's drum sound, and the drums had what we felt like were better timing, and pierced through the mix better, they had a much more realistic "pop" to them that really brought them out of the mix. This is the better "dynamics."
6. The SHM redbook CD was a little thinner sounding, but actually less tizzy with sibilant instruments like the sizzle cymbals and such.
7. The SACD sounded simply closed in, and boring.

Lastly, after we were done we put on the GAUCHO SACD: and it was shockingly better than the SHM SACD of AJA, and also the SHM CD. It might not be a fair comparison as the Gaucho SACD may have started out with much better studio final mixes: but man, the dynamics, instrument location, instrument weight, pacing, trueness of instruments was worlds away and so much better.

We both felt like the redbook SHM AJA was significantly better than the SHM SACD. Even though we both felt like the actual tonality of the individual instruments on the SACD were more true, the difference was slight there, and we both preferred the redbook SHM by a wide margin. We also put on the Hugh Masekela SACD for fun and came to the conclusion that the Gaucho and Masekela SACDs were dramatically better than both the AJA CDs.""

Post by Merganser July 8, 2010 (90 of 152)
As I couldn't say it better myself, I have quoted the following from someone who has heard the new Aja SACD-SHM. I believe it may explain why a few folks do not like it.

"Some people has over the years got so used to "CD-sound" and typical CD-remaster-sound with somewhat harshsness and strain in sound, that when then listening to something that has no artifacts at all, you think something is missing in sound.
Other people mix up distortion in sound with great dynamics in sound."

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