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Discussion: Beethoven: Symphonies Nos. 1 & 2 - Rajski

Posts: 36
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Post by Geohominid June 11, 2007 (31 of 36)
terence said:

It isn't quite that clear cut - the instruments aren't confined to a single speaker as you suggest. The overall mix creates a homogeneous, integrated sound-picture which is not isolationist in the way you describe it.

Terence, I think that your point about an integrated sound-field all around you is what this is all about. I bought the earlier disc of Symphonies 7 and 8, and at first I was listening with my hi-fi hat on, looking at the diagram and working out where the instruments were coming from. I was rather conditioned by the bad old days of Quadraphonics, when one sat in the middle of four speakers, staring at the sleeve diagram of the circular orchestral seating plan in Bartok's Concerto for Orchestra, willing myself to believe that what I was hearing was as depicted on the drawing. It wasn't! Now I don't have either the room or the cash to have full 5 x 5 foot high MagnaPan Planar Panels in my system, so I have to have smaller, but high-quality speakers in the centre front and rears, with a Quad Sub for the bottom end. Despite this, I find the imaging is pretty good, especially if you listen at a good volume. I can sit in the centre, or even at the back of the room between the rears, and still get a coherent sound-picture, which extends around the walls between the speakers in the Tacet case. Having started listening to the sonic effects, I soon gave up worrying about directionality and immersed myself completely in the experience of the superb performance by the Polish Chamber Orchestra. The dialogue between the sections, tossing phrases to and fro in an antiphonal manner, is such a feature of Beethoven's orchestral technique, and to have it so clearly revealed was wonderful. This disc gave me a new and highly musical perspective on the works, and I shall certainly be buying the new disc of the early symphonies. The idea of a Pastoral from these forces, recorded in the round (as mentioned elsewhere in this thread) is tempting in the extreme! By no means will I be dismissing my more conventially-recorded Beethovens from the recent LSO Live or Osmo Vanska series, which are greatly illuminating in their own right, but the often dazzling Tacet performances and recording techniques make for a uniquely involving and deeply personal experience - for me, at least.

Post by Phoenix4 July 11, 2007 (32 of 36)
aoqd22 said:

For the benefit of those in the UK Tacet's importers say they are trying to squeeze this issue into their July release schedule but don't be surprised if it ends up being released in August.

I can confirm that this disc will be released in the UK on August 13th.

Post by hanser July 11, 2007 (33 of 36)
terence said:

It isn't quite that clear cut - the instruments aren't confined to a single speaker as you suggest. The overall mix creates a homogeneous, integrated sound-picture which is not isolationist in the way you describe it.

I did not want to say that the instruments are confined, rather that they are coming from that generel direction.

Post by hanser July 11, 2007 (34 of 36)
brenda said:

Absolutely, Terence, - only those who havent listened would cast aspersions. Whilst you would expect the music to be very directional or fragmented, it comes together beautifully in an overall sound picture with light, space and detail. Non-purists I play my Tacet discs to always praise the sound as being revelatory of both detail and whole. B

Sorry, as a not native English speaker I do not understand the word "cast aspersions". But I do have the Beethoven disc with 7+8 and like it very much. I imagine 1+2 is recorded very similar. So it is not fair to accuse me of judging something I have not listend to. Look up my posting history and you will find me one of the first people here to have mentioned the Tacet approach in a positiv way.

Post by terence July 11, 2007 (35 of 36)
hi hanser. "cast aspersions" basically = to criticise.

and yes - S1+2 are basically recorded in the same general fashion as 7+8. in my opinion they are just as impressive.

Post by JonP August 6, 2007 (36 of 36)
Hi,

I just have a question about the stereo layer in these Tacet Beethoven SACDs. This applies to both the topic of this discussion (Symphonies 1 and 2) as well as the Symphony 7 and 8 release.

When I audioned sound samples from these disks at Tacet's recommended site (www.jpc.de), I noted that the orchestra positioning appeared to be reversed from the standard arrangement. The first violins were on the right and the second violins on the left.

I have never come across this orchestral layout before. First violins on the left and seconds on the right is of course ocassionally encountered, but an actual reversal of two sections is - admittedly - completely new to me.

I hesitate to order these disks on that account, since for all my musical life I have been accustomed to the first violins being on the left regardless of the placement of other sections. But I wonder if this is perhaps a technical fault with the sound samples? I have emailed Tacet about the string section positioning, but thus far no reply.

If anyone actually possesses these two disks, I'd love to know if the orchestra section positioning on the stereo layer is traditional, or whether this seemingly unique reversal exists on the disks themselves.

Thanks

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