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Discussion: Schubert: Symphony No. 8 - Nott

Posts: 6

Post by Windsurfer April 23, 2007 (1 of 6)
I don't need to review this now that Fafnir has said just about everything I would have wanted to say. I would call further attention to the wonderful timbres that are reproduced here and say that I as well was ... well... I found the third movement something of a challenge.

The first two movements are absolute dynamite and I am still trying to figure out what happened thereafter. Taking this heavenly length thing a little far I think. Still I would not want to be without this recording and (while it is true this one is still relatively new to me), I am listening to it at least once per week and getting at least as much enjoyment from it as frustration. If you are in a VERY relaxed mood the ever-enduring third movement is as enjoyable as the first two movements and the fourth was not to my mind, too long, but it didn't have the snap I was expecting from the pacing of the first two movements.

Post by Polly Nomial April 23, 2007 (2 of 6)
Does this version have the bars in the Scherzo that Brahms excised?

Post by fafnir April 24, 2007 (3 of 6)
Polly Nomial said:

Does this version have the bars in the Scherzo that Brahms excised?

I've never heard of any Brahms alteration of Schubert 9, and a Google search did not turn up any relevant information. Listening did not reveal any new material as in the opening of cuts in Rach Sym 2 or PC 3 or the alternate last movement of Schubert's Piano Trio No. 2. However, the repeat is somewhat unusual in that the repeated material starts about half way through the Scherzo and continues until the beginning of the Trio. Could this perhaps be what Brahms excised? Obviously, I don't know and can only conjecture.

Overall I like this recording: certainly it will continue to be played. Having the "full" version is valuable and enjoyable, especially when it is as well-played and recorded as it here. However, I think the score gains nothing by the inclusion of these repeats, and in fact sounds significantly better without them.

Post by Polly Nomial April 24, 2007 (4 of 6)
fafnir said:

I've never heard of any Brahms alteration of Schubert 9, and a Google search did not turn up any relevant information. Listening did not reveal any new material as in the opening of cuts in Rach Sym 2 or PC 3 or the alternate last movement of Schubert's Piano Trio No. 2. However, the repeat is somewhat unusual in that the repeated material starts about half way through the Scherzo and continues until the beginning of the Trio. Could this perhaps be what Brahms excised? Obviously, I don't know and can only conjecture.

Overall I like this recording: certainly it will continue to be played. Having the "full" version is valuable and enjoyable, especially when it is as well-played and recorded as it here. However, I think the score gains nothing by the inclusion of these repeats, and in fact sounds significantly better without them.

Nope it's not that. Those that have the truly wonderful Abbado set (DGG) will know what I mean - if you've heard them, they are unforgettable but poor Schubert. The bars in question come as a very rude shock to the system but it must be said that they add a certain amount of spice to this symphony!

I think, on balance, that I'm glad that Nott and the edition he follows doesn't include these (second rate) bars of Schubert - definitely a good decision by Brahms to excise them! On the weekend I'll post the relevant excerpt of the manuscript with Brahms' hand subtracting (or rather, adding!) to Schubert's work.

Post by tream April 26, 2007 (5 of 6)
Windsurfer said:

I don't need to review this now that Fafnir has said just about everything I would have wanted to say. I would call further attention to the wonderful timbres that are reproduced here and say that I as well was ... well... I found the third movement something of a challenge.

The first two movements are absolute dynamite and I am still trying to figure out what happened thereafter. Taking this heavenly length thing a little far I think. Still I would not want to be without this recording and (while it is true this one is still relatively new to me), I am listening to it at least once per week and getting at least as much enjoyment from it as frustration. If you are in a VERY relaxed mood the ever-enduring third movement is as enjoyable as the first two movements and the fourth was not to my mind, too long, but it didn't have the snap I was expecting from the pacing of the first two movements.

Listening to this last night for the first time I didn't feel the alarm over the pace of the 3rd movement that Windsurfer has expressed. It is not quite as vivace as others have done, but it is not leaden either. I'm going to listen again and then report my full impressions, but thus far this is a very interesting Great C Major. (My C- Major experience includes, among others, Szell, Bernstein, Wand, Kubelik, Furtwangler and live, Sawallisch and Giulini, and just to set the bar, Bernstein and Furtwangler would not go into my recommended list as they are overly mannered, and Guilini was deadly slow when I heard him live).

In fact, all of Nott's Schubert cycle is worth seeking out, and I hope they go on to other things - a Mendelssohn cycle, maybe, which is needed on SACD?

Post by seth April 26, 2007 (6 of 6)
Polly Nomial said:

Nope it's not that. Those that have the truly wonderful Abbado set (DGG) will know what I mean - if you've heard them, they are unforgettable but poor Schubert. The bars in question come as a very rude shock to the system but it must be said that they add a certain amount of spice to this symphony!

Can you be a little more specific about this cut?

Closed